They know your mind better than you do

[Wertbag]

There are a lot of presumptions made when someone says they are an atheist.  Christians will automatically attach a whole raft of other labels to you, knowing nothing other than that one dirty word:
- You hate God/Christians/church

- You believe the universe/life came from nothing

- You are a materialist

- You've been hurt

- You believe in evolution, big bang, abiogenesis and "scientism"

- You actually do believe but just want to sin

- You were never a "true" Christian, never felt the holy spirit and/or were never "born again"

- You must be sexually immoral

- You make yourself your own God

- You are a fool

- You are angry at God because he let something bad happen in your life

- You can't have been in the right denomination, whichever one it was, it was a false church

- You believe man's word over God's word, making people like Richard Dawkins your messiah

etc

 

Not only does this try to stereotype a billion people into one neat little package, and reinforce the in-group vs out group position, it also throws up shields to stop open conversation and any risk of the Christian learning from a nonbeliever.  Why talk to someone you know is a fool?  They don't really disbelieve, cos no one does, they are just choosing to ignore God so they can sin.  Don't even risk talking to someone that evil and immoral. 

We are the ones who know.  We are the ones who share the special knowledge and special bond.  Those "others" are against us and should be avoided as they will try to corrupt you.  Demons are real and infest these nonbelievers, so protect yourself by not listening to their lies.

 

The defenses are in place, the out group pre-labelled and fingers firmly planted in ears.  

 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

2 hours ago, Wertbag said:

 

The defenses are in place, the out group pre-labelled and fingers firmly planted in ears.  

 

I agree!  Conditioned (programmed) deeply into the minds of western civilation by The Catholic church for centuries during the middle ages, and before.  Master minds of mind control.

[Casualfanboy16]

3 hours ago, Wertbag said:

- You hate God/Christians/church

 

3 hours ago, Wertbag said:

- You must be sexually immoral

 

3 hours ago, Wertbag said:

- You are angry at God because he let something bad happen in your life

Looking over your list, I've probably encountered some of the others that were mentioned, but those three I quoted are ones that resonate with me the most since I've heard those in some form, especially from my family.

 

The first one I've heard a few times from my Mother, as well as the third one. I remember being accused of hating Christianity a few times, and recently I was accused of being angry at God. I think in her mind, ever since I have been trying to escape Christianity's oppressive grasp, her religious programming has made her rationalize it by making her think I must have some kind of beef with God, or hate Christians. Obviously I don't do either of those. I don't believe in God; and also while I don't agree with Christianity on many areas, I wouldn't say I outright hate it. Even if I did do some angry rants in the past on here, I think I got a lot of it out of my system. At least for now.

 

I'm trying to work on having a more compassionate approach to religion, especially Christianity because it had such an affect on me and caused lots of problems. I kind of watch a lot of Genetically Modified Skeptic for this reason, because he's like a role model of who I want to be in terms of my agnosticism. (This wasn't meant to be a channel promotion, but I love his content and have been on a slight binge, so he's like on my mind a lot. Might make a post about atheist/agnostic YouTubers I like in the near future).

 

Next, I want to talk about the "you are sexually immoral" stuff, because I have definitely heard variations of that both in recent times after coming out; and just growing up in a Conservative, Christian environment.

 

While sexual immortality in the Christian sphere can include a variety of things (i.e. rape, adultery, fornication, etc), I'm going to instead focus on homosexuality, because that's my experience in regards to "sexual immortality" (lol). I very much loathe- hate, even- that homosexuality, bisexuality, etc, is considered immoral and/or sinful in any capacity. I hate that it has to be an issue at all in society, especially in religious and political circles. I hate being the politics, but here we are

 

I'm fine if others have their own beliefs on sexuality, marriage, etc, etc... but imposing your religious moral standards on people who want nothing to do with it is unfortunately what a lot of them seem to want, since it's pretty much guaranteed that a person's religious beliefs and political beliefs intertwine. Not to get too deeply into that aspect though, because I'll save my thoughts for another time when I can be more articulate about that in full. I just can't stand having these restrictive moral standards wrap around my neck like a slowly tightening noose.

 

I'm sure I'll have more to add, but I've run out of steam to type anymore lol.

[AnonSan]

1 hour ago, Casualfanboy16 said:

I'm fine if others have their own beliefs on sexuality, marriage, etc, etc... but imposing your religious moral standards on people who want nothing to do with it is unfortunately what a lot of them seem to want, since it's pretty much guaranteed that a person's religious beliefs and political beliefs intertwine.

 

^This. What really grinds my gears is that I always kept my mouth shut and never talk about such controversial beliefs around my family and other Christians. Yet, they consistently disrespect that mutual boundary via proselytizing under the guise of "spreading the goodwill." The religion itself perpetuates many non-consensual behaviors and influence on personal and systemic levels (Ex: Oklahoma schools being required to incorporate the Bible and 10 commandments in common core curricula). 

 

A more extreme, sad example was a missionary member being killed by the uncontacted tribe in attempt to introduce them to Christianity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Allen_Chau). He was clearly informed and well aware that the tribe wanted nothing to do with our society, but still went through with it. More frustrating about his experience was that he is viewed as a martyr in the Evangelical circle, dismissing the fact that he and their extremist agendas could have potentially ruin the tribe's livelihood. 

[Casualfanboy16]

1 hour ago, AnonSan said:

^This. What really grinds my gears is that I always kept my mouth shut and never talk about such controversial beliefs around my family and other Christians. Yet, they consistently disrespect that mutual boundary via proselytizing under the guise of "spreading the goodwill." The religion itself perpetuates many non-consensual behaviors and influence on personal and systemic levels (Ex: Oklahoma schools being required to incorporate the Bible and 10 commandments in common core curricula).

I definitely can relate to that. I'm not very vocal about my disbelief around family and believing friends, especially family. Because if coming out as gay was that much of a big deal for them to the point they barely ate or slept, I kinda don't want to fully confirm my disbelief to them yet. I think they probably know I don't believe, especially my Mom.

 

Recently my Mom and I had a little chat that started because we went to a Civil War reenactment recently, and someone was handing out religious tracts. Typical stuff like "oh you're going to Hell if you don't repent". Nothing really interesting. I took a picture of it to show some of my online friends and be like "Look what I got lol". Days later she brought it up that I took the picture and kept asking if I'm angry with God and stuff like that. I always assumed that they knew I didn't believe to an extent, but they went the route of some of the things brought up in the original post. It made those times they wanted me to pray even though I was clearly uncomfortable all the more odd.

 

Why can they be more vocal about their beliefs and values, but not me? So strange.

 

1 hour ago, AnonSan said:

A more extreme, sad example was a missionary member being killed by the uncontacted tribe in attempt to introduce them to Christianity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Allen_Chau). He was clearly informed and well aware that the tribe wanted nothing to do with our society, but still went through with it. More frustrating about his experience was that he is viewed as a martyr in the Evangelical circle, dismissing the fact that he and their extremist agendas could have potentially ruin the tribe's livelihood. 

Oh man that was a bit of a brutal read. I hope his family and friends recover from the loss. Although, I'm not exactly fond of the whole proselytizing to a remote tribe thing. And this death could've so easily been avoided if he was careful. In fact this death could've been further avoided if he didn't get into the proselytizing side of Christianity. Trying to expand and introduce religion to anyone by essentially destroying the culture/lives of people who would most likely rather be left alone is the cause for so much needless conflict throughout history with all the wars and shit fought over it. I don't wanna say "play stupid games, win stupid prizes"; but that phrase is very appropriate here.

[AnonSan]

22 minutes ago, Casualfanboy16 said:

Why can they be more vocal about their beliefs and values, but not me? So strange.

 

I'm guessing that's one of the methods in preventing any chance of cognitive dissonance contaminating their Christian narrative. That reminds me of a church member I knew in college playing the persecution complex card. She posted on her Facebook stating, "Why is it that free speech seems to only be for those who are not talking about their religious faith or God's word. Any other belief, lifestyle or topic seems to be ok to talk about on social media platforms." Yet, I see uncensored religious posts and rhetoric all the time by Fundy Christian influencers and right-wing media platforms almost every other day. Their reality does not compute to say the least. 

 

43 minutes ago, Casualfanboy16 said:

Although, I'm not exactly fond of the whole proselytizing to a remote tribe thing. And this death could've so easily been avoided if he was careful. In fact this death could've been further avoided if he didn't get into the proselytizing side of Christianity.

 

Given what we know about the situation, the tribe decided to entertain John's unusual persistence and interest in them despite their bewilderment. His attempt to learn about the tribe's language and customs gave him the best leeway in gaining the tribe's trust, but it seems that all that effort went down the drain once he pulled out the holy book to be shot at while offering them gifts last minute, as if he was trying to bribe them with limited resources they have just to satisfy his selfish agenda in less than a day. Despite John's unsolicited intentions, the tribe seemed gracious enough to spare his life and have him retreat for the day. 

 

He should have further established himself more if he were to assimilate into the tribe's culture for at least a month or two, but of course would he be dabbling in savagery and "ancient sorcery" frowned upon the Evangelical circle. And who knows, what if he ends embracing the tribe life simplicity and decides to be part of their life like the protagonist in Dances with Wolves?

[TheRedneckProfessor]

A lot of this is due to our evolutionary development as a species and "us versus them" instinct that developed as a result.  For the majority of human history, the need to quickly differentiate between friend from foe was an imperative of personal and tribal survival.  The ability to make predictive assumptions based on scant information was a corresponding adaptation.  In secular situations, one of the first questions we ask when we meet a new person is "What type of work do you do?"  When that person tells us they are an engineer, we automatically draw certain (tentative) conclusions, including that this person:

• understands the effect of condensation on a PLC
• understands the relationship between cold temperature and faulty solenoids
• is familiar with the procedure to initiate a plasma field around an enfuckinated warp coil
• knows how to drive a train

With religious folk, christians in particular, this "us and them" mentality is further exacerbated by other factors that act in tandem.  Martyr complex is where the "you just hate us" b.s. comes from.  Confirmation bias further informs their inaccurate assumptions (every atheist I know fits all these labels; when, in fact, "every atheist" they know is that one guy from church who claimed he used to be an atheist and might still be indulging in certain mind-altering substances).  A number of logical fallacies also come into play, including (but not limited to): false attribution, historical fallacy, moralistic fallacy, kettle logic, fallacy of composition, kaftatrapping, and distorted evidence. 

 

These aggravating factors, among others, make christians seem more judgmental or more assumptive than the rest of humanity.  However, we all do it, just not necessarily to the extent as religionists.

[Casualfanboy16]

1 hour ago, AnonSan said:

I'm guessing that's one of the methods in preventing any chance of cognitive dissonance contaminating their Christian narrative. That reminds me of a church member I knew in college playing the persecution complex card. She posted on her Facebook stating, "Why is it that free speech seems to only be for those who are not talking about their religious faith or God's word. Any other belief, lifestyle or topic seems to be ok to talk about on social media platforms." Yet, I see uncensored religious posts and rhetoric all the time by Fundy Christian influencers and right-wing media platforms almost every other day. Their reality does not compute to say the least.

Yeah, definitely. Especially in America where Christianity, despite it seemingly going down in numbers, is just so incredibly present in so many things. They cry persecution at even the most minor opposition as if they aren't actively trying to hinder the rights of minorities, and other religious groups outside of Christianity. They cry persecution as if they haven't recently put the 10 Commandments in Oklahoma schools. They cry persecution when an LGBT person has enough of their BS and tells them to fuck off. They do that even if you're polite, really.

 

It's just constantly whipping out the "oh  we're so persecuted" card at every turn, even though a lot of things still seem to be working in their favor. Things like Project 2025 I don't see enough discussion about despite it being pretty much a Christian nationalist manifesto that would entirely kill democracy, and essentially turn America into a Christofascist hellscape. Why do I not hear discussion about this irl so much? You'd think with something that has this big of an impact on our country, more people would be talking about it. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough? Idk. I'm just skimming through it for things I understand and the things I do understand have me incredibly concerned for the future for people like me. Christian nationalism is a poison. I want freedom of religion, but not this. We need freedom from religion too. Separation of church and state and all that jazz. I kinda got off topic. Oops. I've just been dipping my toes into politics a bit and decided to look into this Project 2025 thing. I don't understand everything in it because I'm but a little minnow in a shark tank when it comes to certain things, but my god it's so disturbing to me and it's been a morbid fascination of mine ever since I decided to start reading through it- or rather skim in places, because it's long and some things idk what they're talking about and I don't want to pretend I do unless I know it well enough soooo...

 

1 hour ago, AnonSan said:

Given what we know about the situation, the tribe decided to entertain John's unusual persistence and interest in them despite their bewilderment. His attempt to learn about the tribe's language and customs gave him the best leeway in gaining the tribe's trust, but it seems that all that effort went down the drain once he pulled out the holy book to be shot at while offering them gifts last minute, as if he was trying to bribe them with limited resources they have just to satisfy his selfish agenda in less than a day. Despite John's unsolicited intentions, the tribe seemed gracious enough to spare his life and have him retreat for the day. 

 

He should have further established himself more if he were to assimilate into the tribe's culture for at least a month or two, but of course would he be dabbling in savagery and "ancient sorcery" frowned upon the Evangelical circle. And who knows, what if he ends embracing the tribe life simplicity and decides to be part of their life like the protagonist in Dances with Wolves?

Yeah, for real. I don't know what he was thinking would happen. You think he'd be smart enough to stop after being shot at, but I feel like religious programming probably made him more persistent in his efforts to attempt to introduce Christianity to a remote tribe regardless of how risky it'd be.

 

I know enough about Christian stances regarding dabbling in "ancient sorcery", but not savagery. What do they have to say about that? The Bible already has plenty of examples of savagery in it, so why do they not condemn that. Hmmm... I'm not sure . It would be kinda funny if he did embrace the tribe life. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. At the very least, he's resting in peace. Still incredibly fucked up in multiple ways, but Christian brainwashing does things to you.

[Casualfanboy16]

26 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

A number of logical fallacies also come into play, including (but not limited to): false attribution, historical fallacy, moralistic fallacy, kettle logic, fallacy of composition, kaftatrapping, and distorted evidence. 

Neato! I learned a bunch of new logical falicies today. May or may not remember them, but this is interesting. Where do you learn this stuff by the way, as in like... what field of study, I guess? And maybe sites and books too? Idk. I'm just interested in how that stuff operates and where you keep getting all that sweet knowledge from. Also, you are a smart man I want to dissect your brain (metaphorically) for knowledge so that I may one day be as smart as others here. I'm trying not to compare myself or anything, I just want to get more educated is all. Although, I kinda have some trouble learning lol. School kinda put my sense of curiosity and desire to learn through the wringer, which I'm desperately trying to get back into. Oddly enough this desire for knowledge is so fun to me because I can never truly know everything, but I can learn so much because the human brain just constantly expands inward and is like a super computer. I love it. Yet I still can't draw the other eye on my art lmfaooooo

 

42 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

With religious folk, christians in particular, this "us and them" mentality is further exacerbated by other factors that act in tandem.  Martyr complex is where the "you just hate us" b.s. comes from.  Confirmation bias further informs their inaccurate assumptions (every atheist I know fits all these labels; when, in fact, "every atheist" they know is that one guy from church who claimed he used to be an atheist and might still be indulging in certain mind-altering substances).

Literally this!! "I know many atheists that think x, y, and z" No you do not!!! You know a small handful of many, many atheists out there and you are putting them all under a monolith as if every atheist agrees with you when everyone believes (or disbelieves) differently and aren't all the same!!! It makes me want to scream gfdsffgfssfgfss.

 

52 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

These aggravating factors, among others, make christians seem more judgmental or more assumptive than the rest of humanity.  However, we all do it, just not necessarily to the extent as religionists.

Yeah, I don't have much to say about this, but I agree!

[older]

12 hours ago, Wertbag said:

fingers firmly planted in ears. 

I once got into a conversation about Christianity and the other person quickly did exactly this. She put her fingers in her ears and said, "La la la, I can't hear you." What an intelligent response.

 

As to hating god, my response would be that they don't believe in Santa therefore they must hate Santa. And I'd say how can I be angry at something that doesn't exist? (But I do get angry at people who try to force their beliefs down my throat.)

 

As to sexual morality, let's take a look at the Catholic Church over it's 2000-year history and how it has treated too many people. The Church of Pedophilia paid out $1.296 billion between 1994 and 2018 for over 1839 cases of sexual abuse. And the Protestants aren't without their abuses either. Christianity Today reports that ten percent of young Protestants have left a church over sexual abuse. TEN PERCENT?!?!?!? To that I'd say, Holy Shit! They need to clean their own house before they start talking about mine.

 

And let's take a look at the level of hate that Christianity generates toward other people. I thought that one of the messages of Christianity was to love all people. The Golden Rule doesn't have an asterisk with a bunch of exceptions under it. 

 

As to proselytization, I am waiting for an opportunity to use this: When you proselytize you are telling other people that your religion is right and theirs is wrong. That is a form of pride, and pride is considered the original and worst of the seven deadly sins. It is the mother of all sins and the devil's most essential trait. So you need to get down on your knees and pray to your god for forgiveness for your horrific sin and promise to sin no more. The book of Matthew says, “Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven."

 

[Casualfanboy16]

39 minutes ago, older said:

I once got into a conversation about Christianity and the other person quickly did exactly this. She put her fingers in her ears and said, "La la la, I can't hear you." What an intelligent response.

 

Wow! Was this like a younger person? Older? Either way, that's still very sad. Sounds like something I'd do if I was like 4 or 5 lol.

 

43 minutes ago, older said:

As to sexual morality, let's take a look at the Catholic Church over it's 2000-year history and how it has treated too many people. The Church of Pedophilia paid out $1.296 billion between 1994 and 2018 for over 1839 cases of sexual abuse. And the Protestants aren't without their abuses either. Christianity Today reports that ten percent of young Protestants have left a church over sexual abuse. TEN PERCENT?!?!?!? To that I'd say, Holy Shit! They need to clean their own house before they start talking about mine.

Oh god that's a lot of Protestants. How much would that be in terms of young Protestants though? Because there's apparently somewhere between 0.5-1.05 billion Protestants worldwide as of 2024, but how much of that would make up the younger ones? I was going to try and do the math initially, but I'm a little tired for that lol.

 

1 hour ago, older said:

And let's take a look at the level of hate that Christianity generates toward other people. I thought that one of the messages of Christianity was to love all people. The Golden Rule doesn't have an asterisk with a bunch of exceptions under it. 

Yes, exactly! Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like that, and instead they resort to judgemental attitudes instead. Whatever happened to "he who is without sin may cast the first stone" or "love your neighbors as yourself?"  

[TheRedneckProfessor]

4 hours ago, Casualfanboy16 said:

Where do you learn this stuff by the way, as in like... what field of study, I guess? And maybe sites and books too? Idk. I'm just interested in how that stuff operates and where you keep getting all that sweet knowledge from. Also, you are a smart man I want to dissect your brain (metaphorically) for knowledge so that I may one day be as smart as others here.

I'm not really that smart; people just think I am because I have a broad vocabulary.  So maybe I'd recommend a good dictionary and thesaurus.  

[older]

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

11 hours ago, AnonSan said:

This. What really grinds my gears is that I always kept my mouth shut and never talk about such controversial beliefs around my family and other Christians. Yet, they consistently disrespect that mutual boundary via proselytizing under the guise of "spreading the goodwill." The religion itself perpetuates many non-consensual behaviors and influence on personal and systemic levels (Ex: Oklahoma schools being required to incorporate the Bible and 10 commandments in common core curricula). 

 

Yep. Me too. I walked into a mini mart to buy something (not on Sunday) and some guy approached and asked if I wanted him to pray for me about anything! WTF?? 

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

13 hours ago, Casualfanboy16 said:

I'm trying to work on having a more compassionate approach to religion, especially Christianity because it had such an affect on me and caused lots of problems.

I still have a very long way to go before I can do this. 

[Casualfanboy16]

11 hours ago, older said:

For anyone wondering what the pink triangle means... (I had to give a history lesson now. It's my gay right! )

 

https://www.history.com/news/pink-triangle-nazi-concentration-camps

[Casualfanboy16]

9 hours ago, moxieflux66 said:

I still have a very long way to go before I can do this. 

Same. It's so difficult lmao.

[Casualfanboy16]

11 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

I'm not really that smart; people just think I am because I have a broad vocabulary.  So maybe I'd recommend a good dictionary and thesaurus.  

Alright, noted. (I still think you are smart tho)

[♦ Fuego ♦]

Belief is such an odd but reliable aspect of human minds. I've studied cults and scams (albeit when I was a believer), and even when people are given solid demonstrable reality that conflicts with the belief, belief often persists because of desire, significance, fear, avoiding shame, and social reinforcement. Desire for the promised prize, significance of being specially chosen, fear that they are being tricked (instead of seeing that they already were tricked), and avoiding feeling the shame of having been duped. I remember reading simple arguments by atheists when I was still a young believer. They made sense and it bothered me deeply. I related this to a cute lady I knew in the church and she said "Why are you even reading those things? You already know what is true." The social circle pull for me was everything because I was a loner nobody before going to church, and in church I suddenly had a bunch of really nice people being kind to me. That circle allowed me to finally have critical social interactions that were otherwise missing in my life at that time. I had something in common with cute females, I worked the sound mixer for services and became a part of things, I had people my age (high-school) and older who accepted me as-is. You can't really get a more powerful motivator, but I didn't realize that at the time. I figured we were all in on this magic secret of what's behind the curtain of reality. And these beliefs are not always religious, but can be racial or political.

 

All that I just wrote was to say that the bigoted views that believers have of unbelievers are based in a deep emotional need for their fragile imaginary magical world to continue being the "real truth". Some trumpet their arrogant beliefs as reality, most just hold them quietly and keep hoping for that jackpot at the end. I don't know of any way past that other than them feeling they've been tricked, that the system is rigged, that things just aren't adding up. That's the subconscious giving a reality check. If they can get past thinking that might be the devil, then they can take the next steps towards deconstructing and deconverting. 

 

[older]

Somewhat relevant to this discussion: If you're following the news you know that the state of Louisiana has passed a law that mandates the posting of the 10 Commandments in public schools. Here's what the state's governor, Jeff Landry, said about Thomas Crooks, who took the shot at Trump: "I would submit that maybe if the Ten Commandments were hanging on the wall in the school that he was in, maybe he wouldn't have taken a shot at the [former[ president." 

 

Sure. This guy was seriously mentally disturbed and by reading a poster on a bulletin board at the rear of a classroom he'd not do what he did. Give me a break. Could it be that one of the things that pushed this guy over the edge was religion?

[pantheory]

On 7/19/2024 at 3:01 AM, Wertbag said:

There are a lot of presumptions made when someone says they are an atheist.  Christians will automatically attach a whole raft of other labels to you, knowing nothing other than that one dirty word:
- You hate God/Christians/church

- You believe the universe/life came from nothing

- You are a materialist

- You've been hurt

- You believe in evolution, big bang, abiogenesis and "scientism"

- You actually do believe but just want to sin

- You were never a "true" Christian, never felt the holy spirit and/or were never "born again"

- You must be sexually immoral

- You make yourself your own God

- You are a fool

- You are angry at God because he let something bad happen in your life

- You can't have been in the right denomination, whichever one it was, it was a false church

- You believe man's word over God's word, making people like Richard Dawkins your messiah

etc

 

Not only does this try to stereotype a billion people into one neat little package, and reinforce the in-group vs out group position, it also throws up shields to stop open conversation and any risk of the Christian learning from a nonbeliever.  Why talk to someone you know is a fool?  They don't really disbelieve, cos no one does, they are just choosing to ignore God so they can sin.  Don't even risk talking to someone that evil and immoral. 

We are the ones who know.  We are the ones who share the special knowledge and special bond.  Those "others" are against us and should be avoided as they will try to corrupt you.  Demons are real and infest these nonbelievers, so protect yourself by not listening to their lies.

 

The defenses are in place, the out group pre-labelled and fingers firmly planted in ears.  

 

 

Let's see how these labels fit with me as an atheist. I've liked Christian churches and the people that I've met in them, nearly all including churches, Temples, Synagogues, and places of worship that I've been to. 

 

No, I do not believe that the universe came from nothing. What I do believe is difficult to explain to Christians because almost none want to hear it, and if they do want to listen, very few understand it, or how simple reality really is.

 

No, I am not a materialist according to the primary definition of the word, but close to being a materialist in the philosophical definition of the word.

 

noun.

 1. 

personal trait

A person who considers material possessions and physical comfort as more important than spiritual values, mental values, human, animal, and ecological values. 

A person lusting for consumer baubles

 

No, I am generally not a materialist by this definition,

 

2.

Philosophy

A person who supports the theory that nothing exists except matter and its movements and modifications.

 

Yes, I am somewhat of a materialist by the philosophical definition of the word.

 

3. You've been hurt.

 

No I've never been deeply hurt by anyone or anything. I've experienced deaths in the family like everyone else but am somewhat insensitive to negative thoughts.

 

- You believe in evolution, big bang, abiogenesis and "scientism."

 

Yes, I believe in natural selection, the prime element of evolution theory, but expect that some of its minor hypotheses will change over time.

 

No, I don't believe in the Big Bang theory, I believe that no part of the theory is correct. I have a different cosmological theory entirely and have written many scientific peer-reviewed papers on this subject.

 

Abiogenesis,

 

Yes I believe in abiogenesis, that living matter was created from non-living matter, but not necessarily the mainstream version of it concerning where, when, and how it happened.

 

Yes, I generally believe that much of science and technology have a great deal of merit to them.

 

- You were never a "true" Christian, never felt the holy spirit and/or were never "born again"

 

No, I was a true Christian, I went to church often with my family, friends, and by myself, and have a fairly good knowledge of the Bible. I have a folio size King James version of Bible (old English) published in 1640. I also have a German bible from the 1830's with my great-grandmother's German writing in it, when she was 12 years old.

 

But Yes, I was never a born-again Christian. While still a teen I became an atheist for logical reasons.

 

Yes, I do have sexual morals but they are of my own making,which have kinship with some religious morals. The main difference is that I believe in fornication, while Christians do not.

 

- You actually do believe but just want to sin.

 

No, I truly don't believe in Christianity or any other religion, All religions are no more than a joke in my eyes. 

 

-You make yourself your own God.

 

Yes, I am somewhat the God concerning my own life, but must adhere to the law, and often have to answer to others.

 

- You are a fool.

 

I think not, but it's also for others to decide. Never to my face, but knowing that I was an atheist, my mother thought of me as an educated fool   -- I heard it through the grape vine. But she helped my with my atheist-bending scientific writings when I was still a teenager. 

 

- You are angry at God because he let something bad happen in your life.

 

No, wrong again

 

- You can't have been in the right denomination, whichever one it was, it was a false church

 

wrong, yet again

 

- You believe man's word over God's word, making people like Richard Dawkins your messiah etc.

 

wrong again, I follow no man's word, I only adhere to what is logical to me. I follow science but am always somewhat skeptical concerning anything that sounds illogical, or does not follow common sense IMO.

 

It seems like most of the preconceived ideas about atheists listed above don't apply much to me, or many atheists like me.

 

Yes, I know that many Christians think that atheists are not "good people" and have most, or all of the above traits. But in fact many atheists are humanitarians, have great care for humanity in general, for animals and plants, for nature, have great zeal for mental faculties, a wide interest in many things, etc. And some atheists are simply passive, born into atheism, having little interest in religion like their peers in China and Russia.  And other stated atheists are simply rebels, rebelling against many things including religion.

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

8 hours ago, Fuego said:

The social circle pull for me was everything because I was a loner nobody before going to church, and in church I suddenly had a bunch of really nice people being kind to me.

I had a coworker who was a social outsider who told me as much. She told me very clearly the reason she went to church is because they HAVE to take you! They have to take everybody. At least until they find fault in one of the many ways we know they will, like questioning the bible. I find that dishonest and cruel. 

 

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

16 minutes ago, pantheory said:

A person lusting for consumer baubles.

 

17 minutes ago, pantheory said:

You were never a "true" Christian, never felt the holy spirit and/or were never "born again"

 

No, I was a true Christian, went to church often with family and by myself, and have a fairly good knowledge of the Bible.***

 

But Yes, I was never a born-again Christian. While still a teen I became an atheist for logical reasons.

 

*** "True" xtian is subject to change. You aren't allowed to call yourself one. It has to be a consensus decision. By the church. Or whoever. 

 

19 minutes ago, pantheory said:

I have

 

 

 

sex

 

[pantheory]

30 minutes ago, moxieflux66 said:

 

*** "True" xtian is subject to change. You aren't allowed to call yourself one. It has to be a consensus decision. By the church. Or whoever. 

 

 

Yes, I had to stop in the middle of writing with "sex" on the page since I was having disconnect problems with my computer.

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

2 hours ago, pantheory said:

Yes, I know that many Christians think that atheists are not "good people" and have most, or all of the above traits. But in fact many atheists are humanitarians, have great care for humanity in general, for animals and plants, for nature, have great zeal for mental faculties, a wide interest in many things, etc. 

I have had the same experience. Atheists have been in general better human beings than most xtians I've known. 

 

2 hours ago, pantheory said:

The main difference is that I believe in fornication, while Christians do not.

 Never heard it put that way, but if you gotta have a belief system............................

Guess I'm a Believer too!