mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 I need trust to be a decent guy. I ain't mad at you no more. Now I just feel sorry for you. End, trust is something earned. Maybe you should talk to someone about your choice to come to an ex-Christian website, proselytize your religion to people you know don't want it, then insult them, all when you need for them to trust you. I don't have the right kind of training so I can't help you. Personally I do not trust people when they demonstrate they are not worthy of trust. There are many people who operate that way so maybe you should think about that. If you can't get over that on your own then maybe you should seek out places where it won't be an issue. Best of luck to you. I appreciate the empathy, but would ask you answer the question....subjective reality, fact or fantasy? Something simple would be good. Quit pretending I don't answer questions. It's annoying. Subjective reality is fantasy. You would know this if you had read my answer the last time I answered it. If you continue to pretend that I have not answered this question I'm going to have to put you back on ignore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Subjective is how each individual mind responds, reacts, perceives and imagines. It represents only the interpretation of an individual mind. Not reality. Objective reality is the thing to which our subjective responds. Our thoughts aren't real, but then they become real once I transfer them to this keyboard? That doesn't even resemble what I wrote. Your thoughts are real because the electrical reactions inside your brain are real. However that doesn't mean the things in your thoughts are real. Christianity really messed you up didn't it? Isn't that kinda like faith without works? Faith works like a confidence scam. Do I need to flesh out that thought so you can make the mental leap? Quit pretending you are smarter than everyone else. You have a deficiency in communication. That is why you need to flesh things out. You didn't communicate them right in the first place. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 I'll be nice. So if the electrical connections in my brain correspond to observed/rational reality, then they are not fantasy thoughts? But if they don't correspond, they are fantasy thoughts? So I can only count on the thoughts that I can correlate to some objective measurement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 So if the electrical connections in my brain correspond to observed/rational reality, then they are not fantasy thoughts? But if they don't correspond, they are fantasy thoughts? So I can only count on the thoughts that I can correlate to some objective measurement? Yes. Why are we exploring such a basic concept? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 So if the electrical connections in my brain correspond to observed/rational reality, then they are not fantasy thoughts? But if they don't correspond, they are fantasy thoughts? So I can only count on the thoughts that I can correlate to some objective measurement? Yes. Why are we exploring such a basic concept? Because it's new to me. So I think we are getting somewhere. So what about emotions. I really think love is a rational real thing, but it can't be measured to my knowledge. It's kinda like typing my thoughts on the keyboard or doing a service work because it's a demostration of this. Or buying my wife things, or doing stuff for her. It's a transfer of fantasy thoughts to actions, but by default, they are fantasy because we can't measure them. So I am to grasp that subjective = fantasy = love = emotions? If that's your opinion, then we will have to agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Wait just a second there pardner. Hold them horses. I take Fluoxitene to help me with my fantasy or reality? I'm confused now. But that is reality because it's consensus, but we can't measure confused, but we have medicine to help with confused. Damn it. I'm going into breakdown mode. All the repetitive thoughts, all the anxiety, where are my pills? Wait, those are not real pills for fantasy but real pills for reality. Oh gheeze, someone help me. AHHHHHHHHUHHGGG! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 But wait, then to diagnose someone as rational or crazy, we use a human expert or is that a human machine? So is it like consensus that reality that we can't measure now? Consensus = facts? Or subjective consensus = fantasy? It's ok, the expert is an MD. They are always right. Where'd ya go MM? I need help with your expertise.....I'm feeling a little factual today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 So if the electrical connections in my brain correspond to observed/rational reality, then they are not fantasy thoughts? But if they don't correspond, they are fantasy thoughts? So I can only count on the thoughts that I can correlate to some objective measurement? Yes. Why are we exploring such a basic concept? Because it's new to me. So I think we are getting somewhere. So what about emotions. I really think love is a rational real thing, but it can't be measured to my knowledge. It can be observed under the right circumstances; when one organism sacrifices for another. It's kinda like typing my thoughts on the keyboard or doing a service work because it's a demostration of this. Or buying my wife things, or doing stuff for her. It's a transfer of fantasy thoughts to actions, but by default, they are fantasy because we can't measure them. So I am to grasp that subjective = fantasy = love = emotions? If that's your opinion, then we will have to agree to disagree. If she is actually your wife then it probably isn't a fantasy. Fantasy thoughts would be like shooting Ronald Reagan in order to win the heart of Jodi Foster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 It can be observed under the right circumstances; when one organism sacrifices for another. Thanks for the info, the Bible only make fantasy out of this explanation. I'm done dude. Peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 But wait, then to diagnose someone as rational or crazy, we use a human expert or is that a human machine? So is it like consensus that reality that we can't measure now? Consensus = facts? Or subjective consensus = fantasy? Consensus does not mean facts. Whether a consensus falls closer to fact or fantasy depends on the individual consensus an how closely it matches reality. It's ok, the expert is an MD. They are always right. I can't tell if you are serious. Medicine is a practice. Doctors are not always right. Where'd ya go MM? I need help with your expertise.....I'm feeling a little factual today. Pardon? Are you just goofing around? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
par4dcourse Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Love, your state of mind, happiness, sight, smell, all senses, all emotions, are just electro-chemical reactions in your head. (or maybe not in this case.) The brain is locked in a dark rock solid vault, thus nothing penetrates except nerve impulses. Your warm and fuzzies that being a chosen one of some mythical god is just a rush of dopamine. There is even a specific area of the brain that distinguishes between outside or inside generated vision, sounds, etc. God is just a movement of electrons that makes you feel good, and you wrongly attribute it to outside sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 The dog is brown ergo God must be real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Love, your state of mind, happiness, sight, smell, all senses, all emotions, are just electro-chemical reactions in your head. (or maybe not in this case.) The brain is locked in a dark rock solid vault, thus nothing penetrates except nerve impulses. Your warm and fuzzies that being a chosen one of some mythical god is just a rush of dopamine. There is even a specific area of the brain that distinguishes between outside or inside generated vision, sounds, etc. God is just a movement of electrons that makes you feel good, and you wrongly attribute it to outside sources. Thanks L. I need to think about this but these questions readily come to mind. If i am a creation of my environment, it appears that it has lasting effects. Which makes me think, how do "good" people arise from dreadful circumstances? Bad circumstances, i.e. bad "input", would arise in a need to be "reborn" into good circumstances. MM goes so far as to say that love can be observed through "sacrifice" between two organisms And also, why the progression towards higher moral ground. Why wouldn't we recognize we are what we are and be happy with that. Oh, the word grace comes to mind here.. So thusfar, just my initial thoughts, the 2000 year old book seems to do a pretty good job at describing this.....but in slightly different language. On a more serious note, why can we not readily remove ourselves from the "evil" input and change at a more rapid pace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 And where does 'fantasy" reality stem from. You say that it's basically a mixture of stimuli. So if I am dreaming evil things, you really just think it is bad gas escaping from under the covers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 And suppose I come from a family of good stimuli and then I go decide to kill the neighbors dog. Does this not speak to free will to choose, to human nature? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Not directed at me... ...but I do have the gonads. No End. Not everything in this reality can be explained with facts. But not everything has to be, as you are trying to falsely assert. Now you say we don't have to understand? Is this scientific woo? I gotcha, theories are enough.....Theories=faith? HUFWOT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
par4dcourse Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 And suppose I come from a family of good stimuli and then I go decide to kill the neighbors dog. Does this not speak to free will to choose, to human nature? Charles Whitman is a good example. One tumor turned a "good' man "evil". No god involved, or outside influence of any kind for that matter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 HUFWOT. Kentish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 HUFWOT. Kentish? I think the WOT stands for waste of time. H is for hopeless. U is for useless. I wonder what he means by the F? But I have to admit, End, your posts in the last couple of days have sounded like they belong in a Monty Python skit. Just look at the last couple of pages. Are you trying to sound deranged? Scientific theories are faith? Some 2000 year old book seems to do a pretty good job at describing this? The difference between reality and fantasy is a new concept you you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdp Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 You're ass was handed to you when you made ignorant assumptions about my education This is too perfect. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 End??? Im waiting? Or am I just too below you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdp Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 And suppose I come from a family of good stimuli and then I go decide to kill the neighbors dog. Does this not speak to free will to choose, to human nature? It speaks to mental illness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 MM what is it you would like me to say. You would like me to confess that when you say things like modern science can observe love between organisms that sacrifice for each other, that this is potentially quantification of love, that I should throw away the 2000 year old Bible whose theme is love through sacrifice? You would like me to say that the patterns I see are totally invalid because very few people see/make them? Lignification and Christianity have been mixed before, before I thought of it. I am unsure about the internal and external standard pattern, but since you have little training in these methods, you would want me to disregard my thoughts as fantasy? I'm not deranged, more aghast at your logic.....to the point of being deranged....somewhat outraged at the continued denial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 End??? Im waiting? Or am I just too below you. I haven't forgotten Valk, please give me a little time. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 And suppose I come from a family of good stimuli and then I go decide to kill the neighbors dog. Does this not speak to free will to choose, to human nature? It speaks to mental illness. in the year 2000? How about 1500, or year 1000, or year 500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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