Hi....i'm A Christian

[chefranden]

This christian isn't even worth it.

 

Just another generic, unoriginal, sheep come here to bleat their beliefs as if ANY of us gave a shit.

 

Spot on!

 

Now I'm sorry I didn't read the whole thing before I wrote anything.

[HelloWorld]

-Oh ok. Well if I said God is all loving, then that was a typo. God is not just all love. He is love, mercy, wrath, justice, etc. Again most christianity paints this picture of God to believe that is a marshmallow God pleading with sinners to come. But God has other characteristics.

 

You misunderstand what I mean by all-loving. I do not mean that he is only love. I mean that he is perfectly loving, that his love is perfect love.

 

- God has created the wicked for the day of evil

 

...which means?? What is th day of evil? I have never heard this term before??

[HelloWorld]

ThreeD,

 

You just proved my point my tulip picking boy....And with a rather blunt but excellent point from Chef. If God planned everything even that which is evil, it then proves my point. God is guilty of violating his own law and he is criminally negligent. He premeditatedly planned all the evil when he could have stopped it cold and did not. Plus he violated every law he supposedly gave to man. He also shows all the same weak emotions of man. Thus, he was created by man to control man. ......... My only conclusion about you and those like you is that you are a circular reasoning NITWITS! YOU LOSE! Now shuffle along little boy......

 

Prettty much exactly right.

[Jedah]

http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p...p;postcount=331

 

Debunks pretty much the entire premise your getting at.

 

Thank you and goodnight.

 

Well I don't think it does but cool.

 

P.S. I like anime too...not all of it of course lol, but I have quite a few fav shows.

 

Ah but it does. Everything you have said about evil up til now rests on a premise the evil is defined by God IE objective morality. Problem is, as explained in that post, Objective morality is an unattainable ideal that simply does not make sense.

 

The mistake you have made rests somewhat in circular reasoning. When a non christian asks a question pertaining to how the God of the bible is an all just God, they aren't asking for what the bible says, they want an actual logical reason. When your reply basically amounts to "people choose with their own free will to disobey god, so any punishment he dishes out is just" When the entire point of the question being asked is how you concluded that this supposed God was just in the first place, you have essentially attempted to answer the question with an answer that only makes sense if the question never had to be asked in the first place. It doesn't make much sense to say "They should be punished because they broke the law" when the very thing that is being questioned is whether or not the law is even valid in the first place now does it ?

 

Basically you are saying that you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, you know this God is just, because he is God, and because he is just, you know he is God, and round and round your logic goes...were it stops ? nobody knows.

 

 

Think of it this way:

 

I make a claim that everything Bob does is good

 

How would you go about checking if that claim was true or not ?

 

Simple, you would look at what Bob has done and see if it was good or not.

 

Say you find that Bob has killed millions of people, and done every atrocity you can think of.

 

So naturally, you come to me and point all these things out. Obviously I would change my mind about Bob...right ?

 

No, instead I say that since everything Bob does is good, those things must have been justified in some way or that they were punishments of some sort.

 

 

The only difference when arguing this with God in the place of Bob is Objective morality, which doesn't actually exist in subjective terms. In other words, there is no difference at all.

 

 

So I shall ask you then... how did you come to the conclusion that all of Bobs punishments and actions were good in the first place ? Were did the circle start ?

[MathGeek]

Hey X-axis, Y-axis, Z-axis,

 

Morality is a concept, intangible and unable to picked up by the senses. Much of our morality is situational and most humans still abide by certain ethical principles that have been tried and found to be true over the years. The God of Christianity is a vain, arrogant tyrant that thinks of us as playthings, maybe even AI's in a computerized simulation. If the culprit to the crime were not found, that is how it is. Life goes on until 'sheol', friend.

[PiracyOfTheHead]

Actually I do have a question for atheists/agnostics that you've probably heard before. Do you believe that if someone were to commit murder or any other heinous crime, and not get caught and die without getting caught, is that just the end of it? How does that person get his just due for something society did not catch him for? Thanks.

 

Yes, I do believe that's the end of it. Face it: You may want closure and universal justice, but wanting something does not make it so.

 

Ok. So if a close family member of yours was the victim in such a heinous crime and the killer was not caught ever, you would be alright with that? You wouldn't want any justice to come down on that person.

 

Who wouldn't want the perpetrator to feel the hand of justice, regardless of whether the victim was a close family member or somebody in the newspaper. Constructing a belief system that guarantees ultimate justice is just a way to placate the powerless. Life isn't a Hollywood movie, sometimes the bad guy wins and the good guy doesn't get the girl. What about those whom "god" unfairly punished for the sins of their fathers (Exodus 20:5 "For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.) Who punishes god? Maybe your belief system is just an attempt at wish fulfillment?

 

Well I guess it may be a way to placate the weak or powerless. It comes down to the one big problem...if God is just, he can't forgive, the murderer, the rapist or "good" people. I know society always talks about criminals getting off free (OJ may be a good example even though they got him now) and people crying out for justice because of this. You want a holy, loving, and just God to take care of the evils in this world. It may not be now, but all evildoers will get their just due.

 

As for who punishes God? No one. Everything He does has a purpose and all was made to bring glory to Himself. Despite what man thinks, it is not about him. The Creator has the right to do whatever He may with His creation for His purposes. Yes God is loving, but if He is just loving, how shall the wicked be punished? If he is just wrath, how shall He show His mercy?

 

 

Ive never understood this barrel of logical fallacies.

 

It just sounds like a way to cause your God to have opposing attributes, and then create a back story to make him look untouchable and perfect.

 

Could you present this in set form, please?

 

That we may test the soundness of its logic, and not its rhetoric, because its an airbag of rhetoric but its not airtight with logic.

 

 

You SURE you didnt have this clever little goody up your sleeve when you decided to make your first post??

 

You SURE you didnt think about it all day, while at school?? Ran home and watched a couple VenomFangX VIDs, downed a shot of Nyquil chased with a Starbucks Latte?

 

You SURE you didnt practice saying "Flawless Victory" while posting, every once in a while looking above your monitor at the upside down "Thunderf00t" poster on your wall?

 

 

 

[Ouroboros]

Ok. So if a close family member of yours was the victim in such a heinous crime and the killer was not caught ever, you would be alright with that? You wouldn't want any justice to come down on that person.

Yes. The sweet taste of revenge. The blood thirst runs deep in the Christian soul. I don't know anyone who wants torture, blood, and to act out their hatred as much as the religious. Right?

 

...

 

Besides. May I ask you? If someone murder someone, or commit another heinous crime, and they ask Jesus to forgive them, do they get their "just due?" Or do they get a "get out of jail" free card? While the little ol' lady who never hurt anyone, but was an atheist, will burn in HELL for eternity? God doesn't love justice, he loves to play with you.

 

Well I guess it may be a way to placate the weak or powerless. It comes down to the one big problem...if God is just, he can't forgive, the murderer, the rapist or "good" people. I know society always talks about criminals getting off free (OJ may be a good example even though they got him now) and people crying out for justice because of this. You want a holy, loving, and just God to take care of the evils in this world. It may not be now, but all evildoers will get their just due.

Wait a second... you're a Christian right? Or are you of some other religious cult? Christianity declare that if you get "saved" and "born again" and all that junk, you are forgiven all your sins. So what justice is that? The Christian murderer go to Heaven, while the atheist philanthropist goes to Hell? That's not justice, that's favoritism.

 

Bottom line I just want to say that God has to punish evil and be just. The thing is, you're evil. I'm evil. Man is evil.

Two things:

 

1) then it's simply. You go to Hell, I go to Hell, we all go to Hell. No salvation. Unless... you have found a loop-hole to circumvent justice. Aha! You got a way to cheat the system. That's not justice, but injustice.

 

2) and also, Evil came from God. God created Evil (First Cause and all that). And Evil is part of the "perfect" world (argument from perfection). God is above morality and can kill and murder without punishment (morality is moot).

 

So you really don't have any real answer to the problem. You define a problem, and invent a solution that doesn't fit.

 

As good as we all think we may be at times, there are those times that I can attest of where I know I did someone wrong whether by stealing or straight up doing a girl wrong by cheating. It may not have been something as big as breaking the law, but I know it was wrong regardless. We see it in humanity everyday. Man is selfish, prideful, and arrogant. So if God has to justly punish the wicked, that includes all of mankind. The thing is (and yes I already know it sounds crazy to all of you) God decided to come to earth as a man, to appease men everywhere and bear the burden of that punishment.

So are people evil because God made Evil, or are people evil because they act in evil ways? Is it internal, or external? Does God punish because of evil acts, or because of unbelief in a YHWH/Jesus?

 

---

 

And one more thing, true justice would be accomplished if true and complete reparation could be made, i.e. if the murdered victim would be resurrected and restored fully, and the criminal changed, like fix his brain problem or remove his evil demons, so he wouldn't do the crimes anymore. But then, free will would be violated, so obviously God consider criminality to be valuable to his little plan. In other words, evil is part of God's plan, and God wants to exact his punishments, because it suits him and satisfies his evil hunger. God is evil. Not humans. We can't help it. He can.

 

Or the other answer works too: God does not exist.

 

So, Evil God or No God? What do you think makes most sense?

[Realist]

Hi....i'm A Christian .......

 

so you obviously do not have a problem worshiping an evil god!! Do you not have morals?

[Antlerman]

Again, if man's nature is evil than he cannot do good. So you're parents raising you was not with love, but EVIL. You have a child and tell them you love them, but you LIE because you are EVIL and there is no love in that which is EVIL. You lie to your wife and your friends in saying you care, because you can't care because you are EVIL. Charity organization are not love, but EVIL because they are run by humans whose nature is EVIL.

 

OK, reality check. So what do you really believe?

 

Ok then I'll be clear. Can man do good deeds? Yes. Can man care for his wife, children, and neighbor? yes. What do all these things have to do with spiritual good? Nothing. That's what I mean by being "evil". Even though man can do nice things to and for each other, the nature of sin will always come up at some point and you see it in the world today. How else can you explain someone leading a good family life, caring for his kids genuinely, yet he is a serial rapist on the loose at the same time. Even the nicest people will do something that people will say are out of character at times. I would say that man is spiritually dead because of sin. He cannot understand the things of God because of it which is why we say that good deeds mean nothing to God. Is it good to mankind? Of course it is. But it won't get you any closer to God without Christ. This is what makes man wicked.

What? You've just made up your own definition that is not found anywhere in Scripture. What in the heck is "spiritual good"? No... "you shall know them by their fruits". Their actions speak of the condition of their spirit. They are called the Fruits of the Spirit. "Show me your faith by your works." Js. 2:18

 

Here, don't believe me. Believe Jesus then:

 

"

A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit

" Mt 7:18

 

"

For there is no good tree which produces bad fruit, nor, on the other hand, a bad tree which produces good fruit

" Lk 6:43

 

But no.. wait, here you are saying that an EVIL tree can produce good fruit! Are you the Antichrist?

 

Spiritual good? This is a lame attempt to make up some cover-up to continue to support that people are EVIL while doing GOOD. Bad effort. Come on, admit it. Your doctrines are in tatters and you have to face the truth. Quit worshiping John Calvin.

[hereticzero]

Hi all...I'm new and yes I'm a christian. I've read through some threads and have been here in the past just browsing through. I can't remember how I got here. Anyways, I probably don't have anything new to present. No arguments, no other things to try to debate on as I'm sure you've all heard before. If this thread turns into a discussion, then great, I have no problem.

 

Actually I do have a question for atheists/agnostics that you've probably heard before. Do you believe that if someone were to commit murder or any other heinous crime, and not get caught and die without getting caught, is that just the end of it? How does that person get his just due for something society did not catch him for? Thanks.

Rewards and punishments are an invention for the living, not the dead. Even the Bible claims God is a god of the living. When you die there are no punishments and rewards. Christianity has not proven any of their claims regarding the life after death or if one exists. What you believe about after death is a personal belief that cannot be proven. If a person escapes punishment then he died unpunished. If you believe in the xtian version of man's separation from god and death, then that person is punished already for his sin because he died as we are all to die.

[Guest Rabidtreeweasel]

Hi ThreeD...I'm new, and yes, I'm an atheist. I've read through some threads and have been here in the past just browsing through. I can remember exactly how I got here. Years of being lied to by well meaning friends and family members, blinded by their own delusions, will do that for you. Anyways, I probably don't have anything new to present. No arguments, no other things to try to debate on as I'm sure you've avoided all of them before. If this gets you to invoke critical thinking skills, then great, I have no problem.

 

Actually I do have a question for your loving, all knowing, omniscient god. I'm sure you've rationalized all of this before. Do you believe that if a child were to lie to their mom and dad about brushing their teeth, and not get caught in the lie, and die without getting caught, is that just the end of it? Or does that child burn in hell for all eternity? If so, how is that a punishment, rather then a vindictive act of retribution? How does this god of yours get his just due for such heinous crimes as mass slaughter? Thanks.

[mwc]

Actually I do have a question for atheists/agnostics that you've probably heard before. Do you believe that if someone were to commit murder or any other heinous crime, and not get caught and die without getting caught, is that just the end of it? How does that person get his just due for something society did not catch him for? Thanks.

...

Ok. So if a close family member of yours was the victim in such a heinous crime and the killer was not caught ever, you would be alright with that? You wouldn't want any justice to come down on that person.

I didn't read the whole thread (I usually try to...sorry). I'm assuming, as you're xian, we're going with the whole xian meme with heaven, hell and all that wonderful stuff.

 

So, if the person gets killed where I live there's a good chance they're xian. So they die and go to "heaven" and sit on a fluffy cloud and play the harp. Good stuff I suppose.

 

Now our killer manages to live out their life and drops dead having not been punished. Odds are they're xian too actually. Where do they go? We'll leave that for a moment.

 

The family/friends of our victim are all quite angry that no one was "brought to justice" and they fume away on earth. They die. We'll assume they go to heaven for some grand reunion.

 

Back to our killer. We've assumed he worked alone but let's assume he had an accomplice. He was caught and served life. Now he dies. You'll see why I've added him in a moment.

 

Now everyone is up in heaven. The reunion is going on when our two evil doers walk in. Suddenly a ruckus breaks out. Or does it? Everyone is in paradise after all. Why do they still hold a grudge? Why do "earthly" matters even concern them anymore? You assume they do so something must be done. God steps in.

 

First this god takes a look at killer A. Asks him if he was really involved in doing such a thing to our victim (knowing full well he was). The says he was but no one ever managed to convict and punish him so he died without anything happening. Off he goes to eternal punishment. Yay! says the victim and his family and friends. That's totally fair.

 

Next this god takes a look at killer B. Asks the same thing. Killer B says he was involved but was already punished back on earth. God checks the records and sees that he was. Well, no hell for him. "If only your friend had been punished on earth too," he jokes, "then he wouldn't be in hell right now for eternity instead of just some number of years." Ha ha. They all get a big laugh from that. And the party continues with killer B included.

 

Now can you explain to me if this is valid at all? I'm pretty sure that it is not. Being "brought to justice" on earth in no way reflects what is supposed to happen to anyone in the xian afterlife. So if the person kills in this life. Is punished through the death penalty or imprisonment they can still be sent to hell in the afterlife as well. A dual-penalty as it were. So not being punished in this life doesn't mean that you're going to get what is coming to you in the next. It sounds nice but that isn't the xian system. The xian system is based on belief/non-belief. Nothing else. The rest is incidental.

 

mwc

[agnosticator]

Do you believe that if someone were to commit murder or any other heinous crime, and not get caught and die without getting caught, is that just the end of it? How does that person get his just due for something society did not catch him for? Thanks.

 

I didn't read the whole thread, so I don't know if you are around to respond...

 

Do you believe that if someone were to commit murder or any other heinous crime, and then repent and become a christian, is that the end of it? How does that person get his just due being forgiven by the christian god? How about his victim(s)? How can belief wipe out his crime as if he never did it?

[Dhampir]

I realize that threeD is gone, but why should there even be justice in a universe where there's a heaven? I mean, one's physical death is finite, what comes after is eternal and, if the person killed was bound for heaven, then it would seem like there'd be more gratitude than enmity toward the perpetrator.

[Justin]

Bottom line I just want to say that God has to punish evil and be just. The thing is, you're evil. I'm evil. Man is evil. As good as we all think we may be at times, there are those times that I can attest of where I know I did someone wrong whether by stealing or straight up doing a girl wrong by cheating. It may not have been something as big as breaking the law, but I know it was wrong regardless. We see it in humanity everyday. Man is selfish, prideful, and arrogant.

 

Ummm, none of what you listed above means humanity is wicked or evil. Simply breaking the law or doing something you know you're not supposed to do is in no way lumped into the same evil or wicked category as reknowned evil men like Hitler or Stalin. How on earth you can call stealing a candy bar or lieing, evil on par of Hitler is beyond me.

 

To answer your first question, it would suck to know the murderer got away and died without punishment. But like many have already stated, i would not want the guy tortured for all eternity for one vile deed. Being punished infinatly for finate sins is barbarism so far beyond what the murderer did to begin with. The purpose of punishment is to teach a lesson. If one is forever being punished, then that is not punishment.

[Neon Genesis]

As others have already stated, simply wishing there was justice doesn't mean divine justice suddenly exists. Every sane person wishes there was justice in the world. I wish I had a flying unicorn too, but that doesn't mean unicorns are real just because you think it'd be neat if they were, does it? Even if you believe in divine justice, I fail to see how it's justice for God to allow something like hell to send the creations he made in the first place to. If God would torture even Hitler for all eternity, that makes God even worse than Hitler. Of course Hitler's actions are immoral and should be punished for doing, but hell isn't punishment; it's vengeful torture. I also don't think it's really all that moral to commit an action simply because God tells you to do it rather than because you're doing the action because it's actually good. That's not morality; that's called slavery. If physical slavery is immoral, I fail to see why spiritual slavery somehow is. Your claims God can murder whoever he wants to because he's God makes no sense, either. We have a word for that kind of being you claim is just, it's called a dictator, so you are essentially admitting you worship a dictator that's worse than Hitler. And you want us to believe this God is just? Besides, what evidence do you have for any of your claims to begin with?

[Eponymic]

Yes they are false prophets and it makes me sick.

 

Ok I'm gone forreal now lol.

 

Chicken shit.

 

One person calls you on your game and you use it as an easy out to runaway like a scared little mouse.

 

Pussy.

[Guest kcdad]

Hey X-axis, Y-axis, Z-axis,

 

Morality is a concept, intangible and unable to picked up by the senses. Much of our morality is situational and most humans still abide by certain ethical principles that have been tried and found to be true over the years. The God of Christianity is a vain, arrogant tyrant that thinks of us as playthings, maybe even AI's in a computerized simulation. If the culprit to the crime were not found, that is how it is. Life goes on until 'sheol', friend.

 

Morality is not about behavior. There is no such thing as behavior that can be evaluated objectively as moral or immoral.

Morality has to do with the motivation, the intention, the reason for the behavior.

Mores are significant norms, established by society, that have to do with values and beliefs.

 

Behavior can only be legal or illegal, normal or deviant... according to society.

[MathGeek]

Hey X-axis, Y-axis, Z-axis,

 

Morality is a concept, intangible and unable to picked up by the senses. Much of our morality is situational and most humans still abide by certain ethical principles that have been tried and found to be true over the years. The God of Christianity is a vain, arrogant tyrant that thinks of us as playthings, maybe even AI's in a computerized simulation. If the culprit to the crime were not found, that is how it is. Life goes on until 'sheol', friend.

 

Morality is not about behavior. There is no such thing as behavior that can be evaluated objectively as moral or immoral.

Morality has to do with the motivation, the intention, the reason for the behavior.

Mores are significant norms, established by society, that have to do with values and beliefs.

 

Behavior can only be legal or illegal, normal or deviant... according to society.

 

Doesn't that make morality mostly, if not entirely, conceptual? I know we evaluate right and wrong in terms of motive, which is why "the why question" is asked when a person commits an action that is deemed deviant by society. Wasn't that the point I was making?

[Ouroboros]

Morality is not about behavior.

Well... kind off disagree there. It is about intent too, as you say below, but it is definitely about behavior also. After all, the word itself "moralitas" means: proper behavior, or "moralis" meaning: customs. And the studies of ethics starts at the point of what acts are correct, but then of course the philosophical question would arise if a person acts right, but was forced to it, if he was moral or not, so the act is important as well as the intent. Ethics is the acts, and morals is the acts and inner nature of the actor.

 

There is no such thing as behavior that can be evaluated objectively as moral or immoral.

I agree, but that's because I'm more of subjectivist or emotivist, but some areas of the philosophy of ethics, like deontological ethics, claims certain behaviors are absolute moral or not (however, of course I disagree with them). Kant believed lying is always wrong regardless of situation or intent.

 

Morality has to do with the motivation, the intention, the reason for the behavior.

Mores are significant norms, established by society, that have to do with values and beliefs.

 

Behavior can only be legal or illegal, normal or deviant... according to society.

Sure. It applies too, but I still hold to my objection above.

[glebealyth]

Despite what man thinks, it is not about him. The Creator has the right to do whatever He may with His creation for His purposes.

 

This is used to justify the most heinous crimes. Its one step away from "let's just burn them at the stake and get it over with since they are going to burn anyway."

 

You should think about the moral implications of what you are stating.

 

Justice is purely a human concept. It does not exist outside of human thought.

I would submit to you that justice is a concept from God. Especially since man was made in God's image. If you look at the main difference between animals and humans, it's the moral concepts and justice as you say. Animals have no concept of justice or "fairness" in the sense that they don't make laws governing what is right and wrong. They basically just react on pure instinct. I've ehard stories of people having pets such as lions and snakes and then the animal eating the owner. The animal did not have a moral conscience to say, "hey this is my owner and he's taken care of me so I shouldn't eat him". No the animal was just hungry and could care less.

 

Humans are the only creatures on this earth to have a concept of what is moral and right and wrong, which ties into the man made in God's image which leads me to say that had it not been for this, man would be just like any other animal without the ability to think logically and decide what is right or wrong.

 

There is considerable, indisputable evidence for the existence of man and that man knows the difference between right and wrong.

 

There is NO indisputable evidence for the existence of a god, or that man was made by a god.

 

There is, therefore, NO justification, evidentially, for the conclusion that man's ability to discern right and wrong and to make moral decisions depends upon or is a consequence of the involvement of a god in his formation - a conclusion you seem to have drawn.

 

All that we know for certain is that man IS an animal with a moral sense. It is completely possible that this attribute of man is explicable without the need to invoke a god with putatively perfect morality as a creator. Society is not possible without the sort of cooperation that leads to what we now call morality. This progression explains human morality.

 

It is a difference in approach. Whereas the scientist or rationalist approach is to look at what is (man's ability to tell right from wrong) and attempt to discover the maximally probable causes for it, (the "it" here being human morality) and to consider the most probable explanation to be a useful working hypothesis until more evidence comes along which forces a revision, you, in common with most theists, seem to have decided in advance that man is wholly incapable of being a moral animal and invoke a god to explain what you see - a moral human. Quite apart from the arrogance an the poor science, what is particularly galling is the seriously low opinion of humanity that this reveals. For this latter state of mind, you are deserving of pity and compassion. The arrogance and poor science can be put down to education and upbringing; your low esteem of humanity can only be the result of the example that you set for yourself to judge and is distressing.

[Guest kcdad]

There is considerable, indisputable evidence for the existence of man and that man knows the difference between right and wrong.

 

 

All that we know for certain is that man IS an animal with a moral sense.

 

I think you should have to substantiate these claims before proceeding.... for example, how can one man know something is right while another knows that that same thing is wrong? (I just wrote "that that")

 

BTW "Moral" comes from "mores" which means expectations for thought and behavior as defined as significant by society. (Just as "normal" comes from "norms", which are the generalized expectations for behavior as defined by society)

[Robbobrob]

Actually I do have a question for atheists/agnostics that you've probably heard before. Do you believe that if someone were to commit murder or any other heinous crime, and not get caught and die without getting caught, is that just the end of it? How does that person get his just due for something society did not catch him for? Thanks.

I'm starting back at the beginning, since this is where I come in.....

 

As an Apatheist (ie don't care if there is a deity system in play, I still have to live my life the best way I can), I see no reason to assume that there is any cosmic justice....is it cosmic justice when one galaxy swallows another one whole? Is it cosmic justice when a black hole rips a solar system apart? Is it cosmic justice when I get a cold and my body kills millions of virus cells?

 

As a Universalist, I would prefer to think that the roles we play down here on the physical plane have no bearing on our afterlife.....ie if Hitler is not in Heaven (whatever form that may take) then I do not wish to be there either. I can not believe in a system of justice that actually condemns us for eternity for what really is a blip of time we have here in the universe.

 

As a Taoist, I can not accept a universal deity that has such a petty and regionalistic point of view. BibleGod does not have any of the qualities of a true UNIVERSAL deity. He can't even keep peace in His CHOSEN holy land....how less able is He to rule an entire UNIVERSE.....

 

As a Pastafarian, I just cannot follow a deity (the Christian one) who thinks a communion could ever consist of a cracker and a splash of wine....my soul needs real food, such as pasta and meatballs and pitchers of beer....which reminds me, I have gift certificates to Olive Garden, I think I will go tonight....Mmmmm, love my Noodly Goodness, however drunk a creator he may be......

[BlueGiant]

Man, a flounce after four pages. So much for fortitude.

 

Ah well, should ThreeD show up again, I'd point out that, no justice isn't always done (in fact we do a lot of injustice ourselves, I mean the falsely imprisoned isn't rewarded and the falsely executed ain't coming back, either).

 

I deal with it in the most mature way I know how: accept that shit happens, it will happen again, and has happened before, and though it stinks, all that can be done about it is to try and clean up the mess and move on. Really, does there have to be a why for everything, it it that comforting to know that someone is cosmically messing with you?

[Asimov]

I saw that he made a comment regarding "would you rather that evil is just there, or that it exists for a purpose by God"

 

Uhhh...I would be highly worried if a God who created everything felt that evil was a necessary aspect of his creation. You should be too.